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	<title>Comments on: 4th Edition Monsters</title>
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	<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters</link>
	<description>A blog for all fans of Dungeons &#38; Dragons.</description>
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		<title>By: Burrowowl</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23484</link>
		<dc:creator>Burrowowl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Oct 2007 01:24:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23484</guid>
		<description>Could be. I&#039;ve been wronger :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Could be. I&#8217;ve been wronger :)</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Drain</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23459</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Drain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Oct 2007 19:06:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23459</guid>
		<description>eleran could be correct. &lt;a href=&quot;http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters-as-usual-im-completely-wrong&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;A sequel to this article is up&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>eleran could be correct. <a href="http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters-as-usual-im-completely-wrong" rel="nofollow">A sequel to this article is up</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: eleran</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23457</link>
		<dc:creator>eleran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Oct 2007 18:08:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23457</guid>
		<description>The stat bonuses could also be derived by normal stat bonus + 1/2 level (ie 19 Str = +4 bonus + 3 (1/2 level 6)  it works out that way for all the stats presented on that card.  It is also consistent with the way its done in Star Wars Saga edition.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The stat bonuses could also be derived by normal stat bonus + 1/2 level (ie 19 Str = +4 bonus + 3 (1/2 level 6)  it works out that way for all the stats presented on that card.  It is also consistent with the way its done in Star Wars Saga edition.</p>
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		<title>By: Dominic Amann</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23453</link>
		<dc:creator>Dominic Amann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Oct 2007 16:22:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23453</guid>
		<description>I believe Burrowow is mistaken, he has probably looked at the image on ENWorld which has the 4ed card pictured directly above a 3.5e card (not the reverse of the 4e card).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe Burrowow is mistaken, he has probably looked at the image on ENWorld which has the 4ed card pictured directly above a 3.5e card (not the reverse of the 4e card).</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dominic Amann</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23448</link>
		<dc:creator>Dominic Amann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Oct 2007 13:53:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23448</guid>
		<description>They may have changed things, but I have read a designers&#039; note on the Wizard&#039;s that specifically states that instead of Touch AC they will use Ref.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They may have changed things, but I have read a designers&#8217; note on the Wizard&#8217;s that specifically states that instead of Touch AC they will use Ref.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Drain</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23437</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Drain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Oct 2007 08:44:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23437</guid>
		<description>@Burrowl: Do you have a picture of the back of the card to confirm?

Retaining &quot;hit dice&quot; makes sense, since this doesn&#039;t tie level (challenge rating) directly to offensive and defensive power and precludes mage-types (low offensive/defensive, high special power). In this case we can surmise that at least in the case of devils, all saves are 10 + half HD + relevant ability score modifier.

Touch AC according to your source seems to be AC -4. I don&#039;t know if this is a general thing or it&#039;s derived some other way. I&#039;m going to go out on a limb and assume the former; it makes sense.

With seven hit dice, it&#039;s entirely feasible that the creature received 6HP per level (42HP) plus a flat 5 for Con modifier (total 47). But does the 6HP come from 1HP/HD and 5HP/HD Con modifier with a bonus Con modifier at first level, or is Con modifier applied only once per creature?

Point Blank Shot... This might explain the disparity between melee and ranged attack. Are we seeing +2 attack from hit dice, +7 from Strength on the melee and +5 Dex / +2 from Point Blank Shot (and optionally Precise Shot)? No, I don&#039;t believe a 7HD creature would receive only one third hit dice in base attack. Or would it? If the one-third theory is true, an ability score of 10 offers the average person +3 base.

Damage, I still can&#039;t work out why the claws deal +4 (half modifier plus one?) and the spine rain deals +2 (from Point Blank Shot, perhaps?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Burrowl: Do you have a picture of the back of the card to confirm?</p>
<p>Retaining &#8220;hit dice&#8221; makes sense, since this doesn&#8217;t tie level (challenge rating) directly to offensive and defensive power and precludes mage-types (low offensive/defensive, high special power). In this case we can surmise that at least in the case of devils, all saves are 10 + half HD + relevant ability score modifier.</p>
<p>Touch AC according to your source seems to be AC -4. I don&#8217;t know if this is a general thing or it&#8217;s derived some other way. I&#8217;m going to go out on a limb and assume the former; it makes sense.</p>
<p>With seven hit dice, it&#8217;s entirely feasible that the creature received 6HP per level (42HP) plus a flat 5 for Con modifier (total 47). But does the 6HP come from 1HP/HD and 5HP/HD Con modifier with a bonus Con modifier at first level, or is Con modifier applied only once per creature?</p>
<p>Point Blank Shot&#8230; This might explain the disparity between melee and ranged attack. Are we seeing +2 attack from hit dice, +7 from Strength on the melee and +5 Dex / +2 from Point Blank Shot (and optionally Precise Shot)? No, I don&#8217;t believe a 7HD creature would receive only one third hit dice in base attack. Or would it? If the one-third theory is true, an ability score of 10 offers the average person +3 base.</p>
<p>Damage, I still can&#8217;t work out why the claws deal +4 (half modifier plus one?) and the spine rain deals +2 (from Point Blank Shot, perhaps?)</p>
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		<title>By: Burrowowl</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23403</link>
		<dc:creator>Burrowowl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Oct 2007 23:32:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23403</guid>
		<description>There are feats listed on the back of the card, specifically Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot. So&#039;s the hit dice (7), alignment (Lawful Evil), Touch AC (16) and Flat-footed AC (also 16).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are feats listed on the back of the card, specifically Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot. So&#8217;s the hit dice (7), alignment (Lawful Evil), Touch AC (16) and Flat-footed AC (also 16).</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dominic Amann</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23399</link>
		<dc:creator>Dominic Amann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Oct 2007 22:48:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23399</guid>
		<description>I am with Jefffrey here: Stat/3 round up makes good sense, and helps a lot with calculation and balancing. This is perhaps the most ground breaking &quot;leak&quot; to be deduced from the card, since most of the other things are already mentioned in other releases.

I interpret the nethersight line rather differently: my quess nethersight is a particular ability (the ability to see into the nether regions between planes?) that grants +5 to perception, the other 5 comes from Wis. This suggests that skills have no base - no HD.

The absence of a listen check suggests to me that listen is dropped altogether, spot covering the whole &quot;notice something&quot; role.

As to poison, I believe there is either no roll to save vs. the poison - if you are injured then you are poisoned, or the spined devil would roll (again) against your Fort to see if you are poisoned (and slowed) possibly for 5 rounds.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am with Jefffrey here: Stat/3 round up makes good sense, and helps a lot with calculation and balancing. This is perhaps the most ground breaking &#8220;leak&#8221; to be deduced from the card, since most of the other things are already mentioned in other releases.</p>
<p>I interpret the nethersight line rather differently: my quess nethersight is a particular ability (the ability to see into the nether regions between planes?) that grants +5 to perception, the other 5 comes from Wis. This suggests that skills have no base &#8211; no HD.</p>
<p>The absence of a listen check suggests to me that listen is dropped altogether, spot covering the whole &#8220;notice something&#8221; role.</p>
<p>As to poison, I believe there is either no roll to save vs. the poison &#8211; if you are injured then you are poisoned, or the spined devil would roll (again) against your Fort to see if you are poisoned (and slowed) possibly for 5 rounds.</p>
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		<title>By: Sam Judson</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23309</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam Judson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Oct 2007 14:39:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23309</guid>
		<description>I suspect that the Saves are +10 base, +5 ability, +3 level/2 :)

All good fun this guessing stuff isn&#039;t it :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suspect that the Saves are +10 base, +5 ability, +3 level/2 :)</p>
<p>All good fun this guessing stuff isn&#8217;t it :)</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Drain</title>
		<link>http://www.d20source.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters/comment-page-1#comment-23305</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Drain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Oct 2007 12:28:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/10/4th-edition-monsters#comment-23305</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s possible. In that case, either all poisons have the same standard effect unless otherwise specified, or the poison&#039;s only effect is to &quot;slow&quot; you. The latter makes a lot of sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s possible. In that case, either all poisons have the same standard effect unless otherwise specified, or the poison&#8217;s only effect is to &#8220;slow&#8221; you. The latter makes a lot of sense.</p>
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